MATC / Ubuntu / Dell Failure - Rewrite

I wanted to stretch my brain in a frequently unused direction so I rewrote most of the article that WKOW wrote on the online college fiasco that was reported the other day....

What do you think?

Dell, Ubuntu, and the college student

MCFARLAND (WKOW) – Abbie Schubert paid more than $1,100 for a Dell laptop from their online store hoping to enroll in online classes offered by MATC. MATC offers these classes online in a variety of subjects and before enrolling specifies their requirements for compatibility for online course work. They recommend a Windows 95+ or Mac OS* system with minimal computer hardware requirements. Windows 95 and Mac OS 8 are over 10 years old and antiquated by todays standards.

When she attempted to start her coursework, something stopped her. Her new computer did not meet the minimal requirements.

Schubert says she ordered her laptop online at Dell.com expecting to buy your classic bread-and-butter computer.*

She didn't realize until the next morning her laptop defaulted to the Ubuntu operating system.

Schubert had never heard of the Ubuntu operating system, an alternative open source system based off Linux. While most of the world knows about Windows and Mac OS, Ubuntu is a relative newcomer in the operating system market. Established in 2004 by billionaire Mark Shuttlesworth, it relies heavily on community support and distribution. It's free price tag and ability to be customized has made it very popular among computer users seeking an alternative to the dominating paid operating systems of Windows and Mac OS.

Dell computers started carrying computers with the Ubuntu operating system pre-installed on their customers at their online store a few years ago. The decision was well received with computer fans who make up a large majority of Ubuntu users. All laptops and desktops continue to be defaulted to the Windows option at the online store and the purchaser needs to select the option of having Ubuntu replace Windows.

She called Dell the very next day and says the representative told her there was still time to change back to Windows. But she says Dell discouraged her. "The*person*I was talking to said Ubuntu was great, college students loved it, it was compatible with everything I needed," said Schubert.

So she stuck with it.

Later, she discovered Ubuntu might look like Windows, but it doesn't always act like it. Her Verizon High-Speed Internet CD won't load, so she can't access the internet.* She also can't install Microsoft Word, which she says is a requirement for MATC's online classes. Ubuntu would indeed not run the Verizon disk supplied to configure her internet, a disc that was designed to run on Windows only. Ubuntu does connect to the internet using Verizon, it does not require the disc supplied by the internet provider. Verizon who provides internet and cable services for the local area does not have a Ubuntu specialist available to answer questions or help Ubuntu users. Ubuntu will automatically hook up to the internet once an active internet cable is plugged in or wifi service has been detected.

Ubuntu users usually get the help and support they need for technical issues online at many different community forums and website. The official forums are www.ubuntuforums.org. Ubuntu forums is sponsored by Cannoical Ltd. (Shuttleworth's company that produces Ubuntu) and currently has over 63,000 registered users and over 5,000 people can be found online at most times.

MATC does require that students use Microsoft Word (a part of their flagship productivity suite Microsoft Office) as a program to turn in their essays and assignments. Microsoft Word is the dominate document processor the world over and has been the standard choice of students and business alike. Students can actually receive a steep discount at most campus stores with their student id's. What MATC should have been a bit more specific in that they require the students to turn in their assignments using the “.doc” standard. This would have allowed Schubert to use Open Office, an alternative office suite to Office. Open Office (a open source project sponsored by Sun Microsystems) come pre installed on every Ubuntu computer and is free of charge. Open Office can open, edit, create, and save documents in Microsoft Word's “.doc” format and the new version of Open Office can also use the newest Microsoft Standard of “.docx”.

This was not readily apparent to Schubert and as a result, with no internet and no Microsoft Word, she dropped out of MATC's fall and spring semesters.

She also says Dell claimed it was now too late to get Windows and any changes she made herself would void her warranty.

"I'm extremely frustrated," said Schubert. "I wanted to get back to school, but I needed a computer to be able to do that."

27 News contacted Dell, but the company has not responded to us yet.

In recent developments however, Verizon says it will dispatch a technician to try to assist her accessing the internet without using the Windows-only installation disk. MATC also says it promises to accept any of Schubert's papers or class documents using whatever software she has installed.

Dell Computers http://www.dell.com Dell Inc.(NasdaqGS: DELL) $10.52

Microsoft http://www.microsoft.com Microsoft Corporation(NasdaqGS: MSFT) $18.62

Ubuntu / Cannoical / Ubuntu Forums http://www.ubuntu.com http://www.canonical.com http://www.ubuntuforums.org

MATC Online http://matcmadison.edu/matc/offerings/distancelearning/coursesprogram.shtm

Also I do not know if anyone saw this in the thread that was closed and locked but I saw this today from their Assistant News Director...

http://addins.wkowtv.com/blogs/behindthenews/?p=80

Looks like they have changed the article with thier own re-write and are going to do another on air story...

Tens of thousands of people have read and commented on this story, making it one of the most-read stories in the history of WKOWTV.COM. 27 News reporter Dan Cassuto will file an update on 27 News at 5:00 on Thursday. We'll review viewer comments, explain why this story is making some viewers so angry, and explore how quickly it's spreading around the internet.

http://www.wkowtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=9667184 the re-write is not that bad, but still a bit off, but better

I don't want to sound awful but after reading all the comments about this over at Slashdot and Digg, I have to agree with the common response to this and that is: It's her own fault.

She accepted the laptop after realising it wasn't what she wanted. She avoided 2 semesters because of it (surely you would think she would do some research into Ubuntu and learn it CAN do what she wanted.)

But no.

And to top it off, the news company gave unintelligent, typically bad reporting. Her stupidity has been so popular on the Internet, the video turned up on a random RSS feed I keep my eye on over here in the UK.

To sum up: She didn't really deserve to go to college anyway, research and persistence is required for such things and she was willing to give up at such a small hurdle.

Sorry to sound harsh, but that's my thoughts on the matter.

(P.S, before anyone takes this as a troll or whatever, bare in mind that I include myself in the many hundreds of people on these forums that love to help people who need it, she clearly needed it, didn't seek it and then complains. That, I don't like.)

Here's the update to the story:

http://www.wkowtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=9682258&nav=menu1362_2

Sadly, Ubuntu users are put in a bad light, towards the end of the article, since the young woman is now being harassed on her Facebook account.

OZFive said: Looks like they have changed the article with thier own re-write and are going to do another on air story...

http://www.wkowtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=9667184 the re-write is not that bad, but still a bit off, but better Oh, the power of the Internet.

They keep digging themselves a larger hole...

Saying that, there's no need for the users to be so aggressive in calling for the Article to be corrected. Make love not war.

Ubuntu should make her the "Ubuntu Girl" Mark Shuttleworth should send her some support and turn her into a Ubuntu lover. Then giver her a bunch of Ubuntu T-shirts and have her go back to the News and she can tell them how wrong she was and how great it is.

Then again, she probably won't ever get it.

The sad thing about this whole mess is the TV station messed up. It should have been cut & dry that Dell didn't help someone exchange their computer. That's it. No more. Intead they really made it seem as if it was all Ubuntu's fault.

For this TV station's update, they can mention that she has been bugged on her Facebook page (which is so not cool), but it sure would have been nice to see them mention that there were other commenters who were willing to spend the time to help her out get things sorted out with her computer. It would have also been nice to have a follow-up where the reporter tries Ubuntu for 30 days or so and then report back about it.

The whole way this whole thing took shape was just poorly handled all the way around by the TV station. They needed to do more research before airing it. IMHO.

Redache said: Make love

[size=1]To Schubert? Nah.[/size]

Anyways, local news generally doesn't have the resources to make a good article.

I've been personally emailing this newsteam since yesterday when they originally posted this rubbish.

So far all they've done is ignore me and take the worst replies they've gotten and complain about them...

They've dicided to directly label us: http://addins.wkowtv.com/blogs/behindthenews/archives/84

Frak said: They've dicided to directly label us: http://addins.wkowtv.com/blogs/behindthenews/archives/84

Classy. Just classy. He couldn't let it go, sadly. Seems to me this reflects poorly on this reporter and the station than anyone else.:rolleyes:

what the @%^#

But, I found that a very small portion of the Ubuntu community is truly heartless losers. And that is very sad. Stop blaming those of us who aren’t techies for your inabilities to market a product properly. Stop blaming Windows/Mac for trying to block you from offering open source software.

I want each of you to remember why you got picked on in grade school and high school and feel the need to act this way as adults…if you even are adults. PS: let the flame war on me begin…frankly, the more traffic I get to my blog, the cooler I am!

Time to shoot off those emails I warned them about. I'm sure ABC and their competitors will be thrilled to hear about this.

hikaricore said: what the @%^#

Time to shoot off those emails I warned them about. I'm sure ABC and their competitors will be thrilled to hear about this. Aye!

zmjjmz said:

Anyways, local news generally doesn't have the resources to make a good article. ...and national news doesn't have the motivation. Heartwarming drivel, celebrity antics, and brutal violence are what sell.

Sent off my complaint.

How about this from Christine: “It sounds like Microsoft paid you to write it. You should be embarrassed and ashamed for spreading such ignorance.” I have an idea…learn how to spell.

From the bottom of the page:

More Blog Post

Previose Post: Ubuntu on the Brain

That guy is an idiot by the way.But he *is* from madison aka "50 square miles surrounded by reality"

How about this from Christine: “It sounds like Microsoft paid you to write it. You should be embarrassed and ashamed for spreading such ignorance.” I have an idea…learn how to spell.

The worst part is I can't actually find anything spelled wrong there. The only major error is the editor's own; no space after the ellipsis. WTF?!

Wow... that's just very professional. Since when are we trying to "market" a product? It was to my knowledge that we worked by viral marketing, and were doing quite well with it. (1-3% of the market share is rather impressive with no form of large-scale advertising.)

What does he really expect? He called us all nerds and blamed Ubuntu and Dell solely on her mistakes of not doing proper research into buying a computer. You don't need to be "tech savvy" to type "Ubuntu" into Wikipedia.

The thing is that he is just the reporter, his job is to find out things and report about them. He can't give the best view in the world, but what he can try to do is give the most accurate view from his source of the information. It's how reporters work, and it seems that people on /. and Digg don't seem to understand it. He's just doing his job, it's not his fault if he couldn't find out the whole story from just the girl. I heavily doubt the girl in question knows everything on Dell's side of the story. Dell is somewhat to blame, however, because of the fact that they didn't give the reporters their side of the story, the story came out very anti-Ubuntu and one-sided. Again, not the reporters fault, as in this case, Dell truly is to blame for not giving their side.

Please people, think a bit more about things before flaming someone out. Unfortunately, a lot of the flamers were probably Windows Fanboys who like to troll. He is partly to blame with this blog post, though. I do not like his condescending attitude one bit. And does he realize that he is about to violate U.S. copyright law by attempting to post e-mails?

Actually if you read their terms of service they specifically say that by submitting material to them in any form through the website, including by extension the email address contained within, you authorize them to reproduce the content in any way they see fit.

There is no one violating any laws here.

hikaricore said: Actually if you read their terms of service they specifically say that by submitting material to them in any form through the website, including by extension the email address contained within, you authorize them to reproduce the content in any way they see fit.

There is no one violating any laws here.

It's nearly impossible to prove that in a court of law, though. They can't really prove they didn't obtain the e-mail address and send the e-mail via an e-mail program.

The correct way to go about this is to ignore it, not give it power. By giving it power, you are all putting Linux in a bad light. By ignoring, you are giving the news less traffic, lessening the effect. I guess some of those childhood lessons are handy after all. ;)

I agree people are making Ubuntu and its users look bad. Writing threats on the poor girls blog is just bad and I hope none of the forum users from here are doing that.

And making threats to the news agency is not a good idea either.

jrusso2 said: I agree people are making Ubuntu and its users look bad. Writing threats on the poor girls blog is just bad and I hope none of the forum users from here are doing that.

I didn't find out this got slashdotted & dug , she had a facebook, or he had a blog until 10 minutes ago. Chances are at least one moron here flamed them out, and the flamer was probably a MS-fanboy who is trolling to make Linux look bad.

And making threats to the news agency is not a good idea either.

Who made threats? Btw, a lot of people who read /. are not from the United States and any litigations made against them would be non and void.

I want to know how she accidentally bought an Ubuntu laptop. I can't check the whole site, but I poked around there a bit. You have to actively choose Ubuntu. None of the prominently displayed models have Ubuntu as a default, if they offer it at all.

She learns that she doesn't have Windows, finds out she can still get Windows, and then doesn't. Then she waits forever before realizing that Ubuntu wasn't doing it for her, so she drops out of school. Sounds like a real winner.

And this is why I barely watch TV.

The hacks supposedly called journalists these days don't take the time out to research before they report. Cassuto should have spent his time in front of Ubuntu as he did in his follow-up before spouting off in his initial story.

They just care about doing the bare minimums needed to get a sound byte out to keep their audience watching so that the advertisers are happy - facts be damned.

And making those asinine statements about Ubuntu users won't help him any; he's already walking a fine line as it is with his credibility (lack of).

Regarding the Slashdot post.... that one was my fault.

In retrospect I probably should have left the Slash crowd out of it. But at the time that I submitted the news post I thought there was a chance for this to turn around.

Grant A. said: I didn't find out this got slashdotted & dug , she had a facebook, or he had a blog until 10 minutes ago. Chances are at least one moron here flamed them out, and the flamer was probably a MS-fanboy who is trolling to make Linux look bad.

Who made threats? Btw, a lot of people who read /. are not from the United States and any litigations made against them would be non and void.

By threats I mean calling them Microsoft drones or something of the sort not threats of violence.

What people don't seem to realise - what I didn't realise - is that this whole thing was a NON-STORY. This was pointed out to me by Sydney who saw what was there (or not there).

Take point B - the arrival - and subtract point A - the outset - from it. What do you have?

You have one thing. Verizon will help her set up her broadband connection because Verizon are evidently up for Darwin awards.

Is she able to use the same computer as is for her courses? Yes. Check this link for a look at her hardware requirements. She certainly didn't need to purchase a $1100 box of junk from Dell to take the course!

http://rixstep.com/1/1/0/20090115,00.shtml

So what's changed? Aside from Verizon having to come out to complete her account setup - NOTHING.

There are therefore two unavoidable conclusions to draw from this story.

1. There is no story.
2. The 'COW' TV station tried to make one.

You can also add the following: all the TV station did for her was get Verizon to agree to visit her and set her account up. THAT'S IT.

They did nothing else. And most importantly: they didn't NEED to do anything else.

It's been a non-story from the beginning. There are those who suspect more Microsoft trolling here. Which to many including me sounds like tinfoil hat stuff. But in this case - and knowing what evil lurks in the minds of Bill and his Microsofties - I wouldn't put it past them. I'd even lean to suspecting they put some people up to this. People can't be all that stupid all the time, can they?

Cheers.

The reporters blog post is ridiculous. While I will probably not take any major action, I wouldn't put something like that on the Internet especially with "computer savvy" people, as he calls them, crazy about their operating systems. Either way that girl is a moron. Oh well what can you do?

hikaricore said: Regarding the Slashdot post.... that one was my fault.

In retrospect I probably should have left the Slash crowd out of it. But at the time that I submitted the news post I thought there was a chance for this to turn around.

Don't feel too bad, it would have hit /. anyway at some point. I was sorely tempted to submit when I read it elsewhere.

Such stupidity should not be hidden! :lolflag:

Don't wear yourself out trying to refute them. What good would that do? *Satirise* them instead!

Woman Blames Dell for Missing Online Classes http://rixstep.com/1/1/20090116,00.shtml

BANGOR MAINE (The Technological) -- Sally Sutcliffe paid more than $20000 for a Dell laptop hoping to finally be free of the woes that plague Windows. She ordered a Ubuntu system but Dell instead shipped her computer with Windows.

http://rixstep.com/1/1/20090116,00.shtml

:lolflag:

That is the best thing all day.

Granted it's 4am here but still! :guitar:

Love that guitar smilie. That's cool!

Web surfer: I want to buy a Dell PC. Dell: Welcome to Dell.com! These are all our Windows PCs! Web surfer: What's this "Open-source PCs" thing in small text right at the bottom of the page? Dell: It's FreeDOS or Ubuntu. You don't want FreeDOS unless you know what it is. You don't want Ubuntu unless you're a supergeek. It doesn't run Windows software. Here's some great Windows PCs you might be interested in... Web surfer: Yeah, whatever. Let's just click on Ubuntu. Dell: Okay, you've chosen an Ubuntu PC. I warned you. Are you absolutely sure? Last chance to choose a Windows PC! We recommend Windows Vista Home Premium... Web surfer: Shut it, just ship my computer already!

---Three weeks later---

Web surfer: Yay, my computer arrived! Oh my god, what's this "Ubuntu" thing?! Where's the Start button?

---------- Yes, I know first-hand there are people like that. It's not right to abuse them. But really, you have to wonder how they get through life, especially since a Windows license can be bought for about $70 US to install on her computer.

fav line from one of the articles:

Ubuntu is an operating system that contains Linux.

Well they have done a follow up story in print here.....

Thousands of viewer comments, phone calls about Ubuntu computer story http://www.wkowtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=9682258&nav=menu1362_2 *(Which I am pretty sure has been posted here, but I failed to see the link so I post it again)*

What I really think stinks is this....

Send comments to [email]dcassuto@wkowtv.com[/email].

READ THE ORIGINAL ARTICLE HERE: http://www.wkowtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=9667184&nav=menu1362_8_6

That link leads back to a cleaned up version of the story that they released AFTER they this all came to the large scale attention. So someone new might come along and read THAT and wonder what all the fuss was about.

Let's have some responsibility here, if you are going to link back to the "Original Article" let's have the ORIGINAL ARTICLE.

Does someone still have a copy?

Sunflower1970 said: For this TV station's update, they can mention that she has been bugged on her Facebook page (which is so not cool), but it sure would have been nice to see them mention that there were other commenters who were willing to spend the time to help her out get things sorted out with her computer.

Agreed, Ubuntu comes off looking even worse because people harassed her over this. This is unfortunately a major flaw in the community support system, we need one person to step up and represent Ubuntu on issues like this. Verizon, Dell and MATC all had public relations people handle this gracefully. Ubuntu ended up looking like the bad guy.

I wish that things like this didn't have to become so blown out of proportion. As a previous poster said, this really isn't much of a story. A girl order a computer with an operating system that she wasn't familiar with, and she couldn't figure out how to work it. That's all, and it could have ended that way.

But because of all the fuss that we made over it, it is now a national story that makes all Ubuntu users look like stupid, angry geeks. I agree that the news team should have researched further before writing the story, and the author of the article absolutely should not have posted that blog post if he expected it to do any good, but Linux users also should not have called the girl names, insulted her, or stalked her on Facebook.

In other words, each side it is fault. I think it would be best for everyone if we simply let it die out. Don't comment on the story, just let it rest.

Now is the time for a moderator to sneak in and merge this thread with the locked one :)

Probably the best thing to do, I'm not real happy with the situation still but as long as this thread is not out of hand I may as well close it before it goes that way.

Ubuntu is not for an Average user...Here is an Example

http://www.wkow.com/Global/story.asp?S=9667184

MCFARLAND (WKOW) -- Abbie Schubert paid more than $1,100 for a Dell laptop hoping to enroll in online classes at Madison Area Technical College, or MATC. But something stopped her: she bought an operating system for her computer she never heard of, Ubuntu. That's an operating system for your computer similar to Windows that contains Linux. It's highly regarded among some people and extremely popular with certain circles of computer users because it's free. Schubert says she ordered her laptop online at Dell.com expecting to buy your classic bread-and-butter computer. She didn't realize until the next morning her laptop defaulted to the Ubuntu operating system. "It's been a mess," she said. "I regret ordering the computer." Schubert says she never heard of Ubuntu until learning that she accidentally bought it. She called Dell the very next day and says the representative told her there was still time to change back to Windows. But she says Dell discouraged her. "The person I was talking to said Ubuntu was great, college students loved it, it was compatible with everything I needed," said Schubert. So she stuck with it. Later, she discovered Ubuntu might look like Windows, but it doesn't always act like it. Her Verizon High-Speed Internet CD won't load, so she can't access the internet. She also can't install Microsoft Word, which she says is a requirement for MATC's online classes. As a result, with no internet and no Microsoft Word, Schubert dropped out of MATC's fall and spring semesters. She also says Dell claimed it was now too late to get Windows and any changes she made herself would void her warranty. "I'm extremely frustrated," said Schubert. "I wanted to get back to school, but I needed a computer to be able to do that." 27 News contacted Dell, but the company has not responded to us yet. However, we think we've helped her get back to school. Verizon says it will dispatch a technician to try to assist her accessing the internet without using the Windows-only installation disk. Verizon says its high-speed internet does indeed support Ubuntu, but some advanced features and installation disks clearly don't work with Linux. MATC also says it promises to accept any of Schubert's papers or class documents using whatever software she has installed. Schubert's computer came with Open Office, a word processing software package that is compatible with Microsoft Word. She says she wasn't aware it was compatible. MATC promised to show her how to save documents in compatible formats so she could enroll in online courses again.

What are your opinions?

Old story is old.

it's not for the Power User either!

Dell needed to sort out their customer support in 2009.

I could not disagree more.

I am an "average user" , Using ubuntu for 1& 1/2 years... and Ive never had a better or easier time with my computers since using Ubuntu!

Same goes for my whole family, and most friends.. They are all far more "average users" than even me.. (most of them computer/technology illiterate) But they all use Ubuntu every single day, and nothing but Ubuntu.. and theyve had less problems since using Ubuntu than they ever had with windows.

They dont even have to contact me for computer help anymore. Yet they were constantly contacting me to help with some problem in windows.

After they have been using Ubuntu for many months (from 7 to 11 months).. They also tell me they feel the same as I.. That they have never had a better computer experience.

So yes.. Ubuntu* is* definitely great for the "average user"!

It's not even a question to me anymore, after seeing how many people Ive gotten to switch to Ubuntu, and knowing the kind of people they are.. it's a fact! Ubuntu IS for the average user. :) I've watched people from ages 7 to 80 use ubuntu on a daily basis with no issues. Very few of them "tech-savvy" .

This is my experience, not my opinions, or feelings.. but simply my experiences.

have a nice day. :)

Aside from the fact that it's a very old and often-linked story, the last two paragraphs sum it up very well. It's the age-old case of someone not getting what they expected, and not really knowing what they are doing (most people don't care about computer OSs).

I reported this, simply because it's not a testimonial - it's just an old link.

Well I never really was an average user in computers until it came down to Ubuntu. I got the hang of it (but I needed some help. I started at 7.10 Gusty Ribbon and I literally had no idea how to install it. Everytime I wanted to give it a shot, it meant removing Windows because I didn't know how to partition at the time. Even later on when I knew how to partition in Windows, I still had trouble partitioning in Ubuntu. It was so confusing. 11.04 changed though.) I kept switching to Windows, since I always found Ubuntu to be terribly plain and ugly in appearance. No matter how good an operating system is, I need more than for it to work, I need it to look good. I don't want looking at a computer to be a chore. But I eventually got a dock and just settled.

Glad to see 11.04 was the first major overhaul in the design since it started. Not just two plain panels. Never really liked the panels anyways. Actually have some friends considering on switching, too.

A major turnoff is the notion that people that use Ubuntu are either nerds, people with old CRT monitors that need something to speed up their computer, or poor people from Latin America countries that can't speak English (Idk about you, but I've heard that stereotype several times). (Twitter search Ubuntu and you'll need translation) I don't consider myself a nerd, and that's not because I disagree with the definition of nerd or something. I don't sit by my computer watching downloaded Anime, hacking, staring at Terminals or making my computer setup look like Star Trek or something incredibly stupid like that. I have a shiny Toshiba laptop. I Facebook, Tweet, chat, go outside and party. The only nerdy thing I do is watch the news, if that's even considered nerdy. I always have my tv tuned to CNN, always tweeting about the news. No big deal.

I'm a little surprised that people have success stories of average users using Ubuntu, though. Every time I tell a Linux user that Ubuntu should try harder to get a bigger market share, they argue about the definition of "cool" or why it matters, so it doesn't seem like the Ubuntu community really wants Ubuntu to be a little more successful.

For Linux to succeed as a replacement to Windows desktop It has to get proprietary software like how Mac OSX got..Adobe Products, Phone Managers from majors like Nokia, Samsung, HTC.. And also MS Office for Linux..Open office does'nt or can never replace MS office.. in any case

Well, same old story, I'm pretty much an average user and decided to switch to Ubuntu about two years ago. It's true that it's not always simple (especially for getting sound and video to work properly), but there is a lot of competent and friendly support around, which is much more efficient and fun than the typical incompetent customer support. I can see the difference when I need to boot XP (left the dual boot option) - soooooo slow... And I mean, this sounds like an urban legend, missing courses because of an OS, for real?

krishna.988 said: For Linux to succeed as a replacement to Windows desktop It has to get proprietary software like how Mac OSX got..Adobe Products, Phone Managers from majors like Nokia, Samsung, HTC.. And also MS Office for Linux..Open office does'nt or can never replace MS office.. in any case

well your entitled to your opinion. which is what all that is.. opinions. :)

And I mean, this sounds like an urban legend, missing courses because of an OS, for real?

Title should have read "Higher Education Is Not for Average Users." I don't think that would be entirely inaccurate.

My father works on the computer once in a week, just e-mails and surfing. My sister uses the computer every day, as a regular user: just chat, surfing, text documents, presentations, mailing ... so everything she has to do for school.

And I must say, when our main computer had Windows: they were always complaining about the speed. When I looked, I saw that some program was updating itself or that the computer was scanning for virusses. I tried but couldn't speed the computer up. So my final thought was to install Linux (I installed Mint).

Now, they are working with Linux for over 3 months, and I did only get one complaint. And that complaint was something with the mint menu: the search function crashed and used too much CPU, so the computer blokked.

But one complaint against a complaint every time the computer is started, that's a big difference. So I would say that linux (if properly installed) is perfect for an average user.

krishna.988 said: For Linux to succeed as a replacement to Windows desktop It has to get proprietary software like how Mac OSX got..Adobe Products, Phone Managers from majors like Nokia, Samsung, HTC.. And also MS Office for Linux..Open office does'nt or can never replace MS office.. in any case

Rasa1111 said: well your entitled to your opinion.

which is what all that is.. opinions. :)

Yes it is his opinion, but he is right, Linux is a better OS than Windows, but without the support of the major software houses it is not going to succeed as a Windows replacement. When people buy any product, especially one that can be a daunting purchase, they will go for brands they have heard of. So imagine you are Joe average computer user are you...

a. Going to buy a computer with a known OS from a high profile company like Microsoft or are you going to buy a computer with an OS named after an obscure African word from a company you have never heard of, Canonical.

and..

b. A computer with an OS that doesn't have a well known Office Suite like MS Office but a Office suite that is nearly 100% compatible with MS Office, but not quite. A graphics suite that sounds like it is named after a sex slave, that is almost as good as Adobe Photoshop, but not quite, an OS that doesn't actually support your iPhone in any real way and any peripheral hardware may or may not work on.

Answer, no you are not.

If you could walk into your favourite computer store and buy all Adobe products for Linux, MS Office for Linux, download and use iTunes, 100% guarantee that any piece of hardware would work faultlessly by just installing a driver by process of pointing and clicking and get it supported by any technician anywhere, then Linux would be on to a winner as it is a better OS.

For Linux to succeed and replace Windows on the desktop it needs the support of the major vendors. FACT.

Wow, a single incident from two years ago in which a student mistakenly purchased a computer that doesn't support the specific applications she needs can only mean the Linux platform is completely doomed!

;)

Well put. = )

As for a legitimately good operating system with the support of major software vendors - like OSX? Admittedly, OSX being primarily distributed on pricey Apple computers doesn't much help, but would it really make *that* much a difference?

Four years ago I switched to Linux, and have been doing all my work - photo editing, video editing, sound editing, document management, word-processing, presentations, spreadsheets, on-line banking - oh well, pretty much everything I could think of. And I regularly exchange files with Windows users who don't care how they were created as long as they can open, read, edit and save them.

I do not hate Windows, nor do I hate Microsoft, and I have a great respect for Bill Gates. I don't use Windows, but that is my rational, considered decision, not born out of strong emotion. I do miss Windows. (a) There are some Web-sites that insist you use Internet Explorer. (b) Microsoft has got a very good handle on handwriting recognition (of cursive writing).

I guess I am not an average user.

Avoidable with 10 minutes of research on the internet. I am doubting the "average user" status here.

krishna.988 said: For Linux to succeed as a replacement to Windows desktop It has to get proprietary software like how Mac OSX got..Adobe Products, Phone Managers from majors like Nokia, Samsung, HTC.. And also MS Office for Linux..Open office does'nt or can never replace MS office.. in any case

In other words, Linux cannot succeed by simply improving the interface to be more "user-friendly." Consumer technology is not a meritocracy, and it never has been.

It's about companies making deals with other companies and pushing various products through marketing.

Look at how Android just came out of nowhere to be a major force in the smartphone market. It wasn't because Android was this amazing OS (the early iterations were actually quite terrible). It was because of the power of Google. Same deal with Chrome OS. Already because of the power of Google, Netflix will be ported to Linux for an OS that hasn't even been officially released yet.

And for years Netflix never ported native streaming to Linux, no matter how "improved" Ubuntu was. Ubuntu just doesn't have the corporate muscle that Google has.

speedwell68 said:

b. A computer with an OS that doesn't have a well known Office Suite like MS Office but a Office suite that is nearly 100% compatible with MS Office, but not quite. A graphics suite that sounds like it is named after a sex slave, that is almost as good as Adobe Photoshop, but not quite, an OS that doesn't actually support your iPhone in any real way and any peripheral hardware may or may not work on.

Answer, no you are not.

If you could walk into your favourite computer store and buy all Adobe products for Linux, MS Office for Linux, download and use iTunes, 100% guarantee that any piece of hardware would work faultlessly by just installing a driver by process of pointing and clicking and get it supported by any technician anywhere, then Linux would be on to a winner as it is a better OS.

For Linux to succeed and replace Windows on the desktop it needs the support of the major vendors. FACT.

Actually most users don't use photoshop and other Adobe products except for the free pdf reader, which is available for Linx (acroread) though the default document readers (evince or Okular) are actually much better.

Among the people who tell you they use Photoshop most only use a tiny subset of its functions even gimp would be an overkill, and chances are they use unlicensed copies, otherwise known as pirated copies.

Most of the things you need MSOffice for can be replaced by Open/LibreOffice, again many people use unlicensed MSO simply because they can, not that they really need some unique feature (and if you must use MSO, Office 2007 runs well in WINE)

And itune is crap even in windows and very few people I know (20 and 3o somehing crowd ) actually use itune to manage their music collections and even fewer for whom there are no other alternatives.

beew said: Actually most users don't use photoshop and other Adobe products except for the free pdf reader, which is available for Linx (acroread) though the default document readers (evince or Okular) are actually much better.

Among the people who tell you they use Photoshop most only use a tiny subset of its functions even gimp would be an overkill, and chances are they use unlicensed copies, otherwise known as pirated copies.

Most of the things you need MSOffice for can be replaced by Open/LibreOffice, again many people use unlicensed MSO simply because they can, not that they really need some unique feature (and if you must use MSO, Office 2007 runs well in WINE)

And itune is crap even in windows and very few people I know (20 and 3o somehing crowd ) actually use itune to manage their music collections and even fewer for whom there are no other alternatives.

One more thing to add to your comment..

Many or a substantial number have access to Windows Pirated copy with MS office and other Adobe products..when they are able to get all these for "free"..its hard to think for people to switch over to Linux.. and one major thing Linux to become popular it has to be standardized..1 Desktop manager..1 distro...1 particular installation method..then it would definitely become popular in desktop market.. I want this to happen...

Because I love like LINUX...

Locked. Necromancy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qj8p-PEwbI

It's from 2009, so it might have been posted here already, but I could not find it.

I'm not a zealot [at all], I actually don't even care about what OS people are using [hey, its all about the applications, isn't it], but I thought this little clip was fun. It screams 'NOBODY ACTUALLY KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT' in capital letters. Everybody included in the video, they all have no clue.

Cheerio mates ! :)

Phrea said: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qj8p-PEwbI

It's from 2009, so it might have been posted here already, but I could not find it.

I'm not a zealot [at all], I actually don't even care about what OS people are using [hey, its all about the applications, isn't it], but I thought this little clip was fun. It screams 'NOBODY ACTUALLY KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT' in capital letters. Everybody included in the video, they all have no clue.

Cheerio mates ! :)

Welcome to the world of someone who isn't a nerd turning on a linux machine. ;)

This shows why OEM's are not queuing up to supply ubuntu and other Linux Distributions to the consumer market.

KiwiNZ said: This shows why OEM's are not queuing up to supply ubuntu and other Linux Distributions to the consumer market.

If OEMs were lining up to supply linux distributions, the same thing could have happened to someone who accidentally got Windows7.

"What do I do with this, I wanted a complete operating system, and all I got was X windows version 7?"

:lolflag:

IMO it wasn't Dell's fault, she clearly should of noticed that it would be coming with Ubuntu when ordering it.

Quite a interesting Title

Who calls the news about something like this? I would have been fine with the story if they didn't paint Linux up as useless. The follow up reporting was a bit better though.

Not being able to load a Verizon CD is a fault of Verizon. Granted all you need to do is borrow a Windows machine or likely just call Verizon about it.

As for word compatibility it is near enough perfect but perhaps it wasn't back in 7.10 (do not remember). Though I used to struggle with every type of Word file not being compatible with any other version of Word so who are they kidding!

If you stand back and watch it without wanting to defend Ubuntu from the start, you will notice that this was a good thing for Ubuntu, after the girl had her little hissy fit the news team said they contacted the school, who stated they were fine with Open Office and Ubuntu and it was not to late to enroll, they contacted the isp, who stated that it will work on Ubuntu with no configuration needed by her. In all honesty I cannot see her passing any course with the "oh poor me" attitude she has, also she has just raised the bar for the dumbest blond award.

Cheers David

Trying to place the blame for her ignorance on others. There's so many things I want to point out that bug me about this, like how she could have used a public library computer or a friend's. But somehow her entire college career is all gone because of an operating system, sure, right.

Ridiculous. Sounds like she wasn't all that motivated in the first place to get a degree. Many people who really wants to get a degree will go into debt for the rest of their lives if they have to, write hundreds of scholarship applications, and ask for recommendations etc. But heaven forbid this woman's internet connection doesn't work for a day, no, that's automatically enough to drop out. Something obviously wrong with her head.

And this is not even taking into account that her issue was eventually solved to begin with! Her ISP helped her and she was able to use OpenOffice for her work in the end. What a sensationalist load of garbage.

Ubuntu Causes Girl To Drop Out of College [Spectacular title, isn't it]

Can someone place this (stupid) text on the Debian forum??? This will give them enough ammo to bash Ubuntu for another 6 months!!! :twisted:

nomko said: ****

Can someone place this (stupid) text on the Debian forum??? This will give them enough ammo to bash Ubunbtu for another 6 months!!! :twisted:

Heh yeah would be some interesting 'discussion'. :)

haha. the follow up. The fallout when the Ubuntu zealots chine in

Dell honestly sells/sold Ubuntu laptops without out-of-the-box Wireless?

Edit: Watched the follow up above. Dell sold a half-baked laptop, the consumer blamed Ubuntu for everything, and the fanboys flamed the consumer for making a mistake. And it made News. lol.

kaldor said: Dell honestly sells/sold Ubuntu laptops without out-of-the-box Wireless?

Edit: Watched the follow up above. Dell sold a half-baked laptop, the consumer blamed Ubuntu for everything, and the fanboys flamed the consumer for making a mistake. And it made News. lol.

The problem was that the supplied ISP software on cd did not boot, of course it didn't, its for Windows and Mac only.

Cheers David

I wonder how she managed to buy that laptop in the first place.

IIRC, in order to buy an Ubuntu Dell, you had to 1/ know the things existed 2/ dig deep into Dell's web site to even find them.

Someone getting a Mac with iWork might have the same kinds of issues. Most of the comments I see are, for the sake of clarity, going overboard in support of Linux as an all-in-one solution or detracting it as an utterly useless and unusable mess.

Sometimes I just have to draw the line on what I'm willing to put in my brain, and I'm sorry someone at a news station has to read through so much of the poorly thought out opinions. Even if they're paid. XD

EDIT: K, maybe a Mac would have worked now that I'm reading into it a bit further. XD Her expectations of Ubuntu weren't really that high.

The whole pouting at home and "poor me, someone needs to solve my problems" attitude that she has really torques me. Take some initiative, learn something new, or go flip burgers. If she can't, at the very least, get on track to solving the internet issue, she won't last long in college.

koenn said: I wonder how she managed to buy that laptop in the first place.

IIRC, in order to buy an Ubuntu Dell, you had to 1/ know the things existed 2/ dig deep into Dell's web site to even find them.

This was my logic. There is more than meets the eye on how she ended up with that laptop. She was asking for trouble the moment she went to the news.

Ehh... this is why i think Linux just should stay away from the average user. We live in a Windows world. The average person thinks Windows when they think computer. Its the only thing that exists for them.

Unlike geeks, the average person has no interest in learning how to use a computer. They dont wanna learn it and they wont put any effort to do so. They just wanna turn it on and get things done with no knowledge or effort. That's why we're getting these new fancy, flashy and big buttony interfaces. They're trying to make it easier and more appealing for the average person.

Of course, since they dont wanna learn, eventually these new big buttony and fancy interfaces will be too hard and we'll have to make things simpler and simpler. Until we're living in a real life version of Idiocracy. Where the keyboard will have only two buttons. One that says "Solve my problems" and one that says "Entertain me".