Archived thread 1065354 from openSUSE and SUSE Linux Enterprise. Markdown source: openSUSE_and_SUSE_Linux_Enterprise/thread_1065354_OpenSuse_=_Windows_Vista_for_linux.md
Hey there,
I was dual booting ubuntu and OpenSuse for awhile just to try out some of the different linux distros, and i pretty much hated suse :( It was slow, laggy, crashed a lot and generally a pain in the butt. I hated the guts out of all of my drivers, audio and video. And it didn't seem to care to much for system stability. Sorry if any of you out there are big fans of OpenSuse, but im just curious to see if anyone else had en experience like I did with it.
It was just way to slow for me, thanks to Yast. I prefer to use Ubuntu, Or a debian derivative, they seem to be faster, and catch dependencies better. But that just might be me.
SUSE was ok for about the 3 hours I used it xD. Just preferred Mandriva and Kubuntu that's all
perlluver said: It was just way to slow for me, thanks to Yast. I prefer to use Ubuntu, Or a debian derivative, they seem to be faster, and catch dependencies better. But that just might be me.
Last time I tried it was like OpenSuse 11.1 but I agree with what you said and had the same experience. I expect more out of a company like Novell.
Oh, how I HATED Yast. If your not careful that thing will screw up your partition by recommending all the wrong mount points and flags. I also really didn't like the UI a whole lot
jrusso2 said: Last time I tried it was like OpenSuse 11.1 but I agree with what you said and had the same experience. I expect more out of a company like Novell.
But then again Novell works a lot with Microsoft...
The KDE version of openSUSE, though pretty, gave me headaches. The GNOME version was a vast improvement for me actually, and very few issues, though I'm not a fan of YaST2. SLED gave me far fewer issues.
Sorivenul said: The KDE version of openSUSE, though pretty, gave me headaches. The GNOME version was a vast improvement for me actually, and very few issues, though I'm not a fan of YaST2. SLED gave me far fewer issues.
I ran gnome from the start as I'm not a huge fan of KDE, although ill use it when in comes to something like slackware.
Yast2 is very much a love/hate thing. Personally, I find Yast more usable than Synaptic, although I like debians over rpms...
Greg said: Yast2 is very much a love/hate thing. Personally, I find Yast more usable than Synaptic, although I like debians over rpms...
Yea i guess so...
I don't know what the heck you installed on it, but OpenSuSE Runs much faster than Ubuntu on my Desktop, it also uses less memory and YaST is really powerful.
But then again Novell works a lot with Microsoft...
By the way I'll clear this up now, if you object to a Distro made by Novell because of that very reason, Linux is not for you. Novell contribute considerable amounts of code to:
The Kernel Gnome Evolution OpenOffice etc
All of the above are to be found in Ubuntu so using that is not a valid argument.
unplugged23 said: Hey there,
I was dual booting ubuntu and OpenSuse for awhile just to try out some of the different linux distros, and i pretty much hated suse :( It was slow, laggy, crashed a lot and generally a pain in the butt. I hated the guts out of all of my drivers, audio and video. And it didn't seem to care to much for system stability. Sorry if any of you out there are big fans of OpenSuse, but im just curious to see if anyone else had en experience like I did with it.
It works just as fine as Ubuntu and other distros on my setup and I didn't have any of the problems you mentioned. I actually prefer openSUSE to Ubuntu because of YaST (not the packaging tool, but the control centre) and just how it looks and feels a bit more professional.
Oh, how I HATED Yast. If your not careful that thing will screw up your partition by recommending all the wrong mount points and flags. I also really didn't like the UI a whole lot
They are just recommendations and you are free to change them if you don't like them.
I agree as well opensuse ran veryslow and even froze up within like the first half hour of using iT! But thats just for me...
unplugged23 said: But then again Novell works a lot with Microsoft...
FUD.
This is covered many times in many places around the forums. Despite the often excellent explanations and opinions on the matter, the original statements, "straight from the horse's mouth", offer a more orderly and informative approach. Examining the following will hopefully help clarify the Novell-Microsoft agreement for others: Novell and Microsoft - Working Together for Customers (From Novell) Open Letter to the Community (From Novell) Microsoft and Novell Collaborate (From Novell) Microsoft & Novell Interoperability Collaboration (From Microsoft) Microsoft and Novell Collaboration FAQ (From Microsoft) Novell and Microsoft - Interoperability (Joint Project)
Sorivenul said: FUD.
This is covered many times in many places around the forums. Despite the often excellent explanations and opinions on the matter, the original statements, "straight from the horse's mouth", offer a more orderly and informative approach. Examining the following will hopefully help clarify the Novell-Microsoft agreement for others: Novell and Microsoft - Working Together for Customers (From Novell) Open Letter to the Community (From Novell) Microsoft and Novell Collaborate (From Novell) Microsoft & Novell Interoperability Collaboration (From Microsoft) Microsoft and Novell Collaboration FAQ (From Microsoft) Novell and Microsoft - Interoperability (Joint Project)
Thanks for the links very helpful.
I really like openSuse 11.1. Very stable and responsive. The Yast Control Center makes it easy to do any of the system configuration and install hardware, basically everthing pertaining the system is there.
Yast is working just fine, a bit slow at times, but not always.
Novell has contributed much to Linux. OpenOffice is a great program and Novell gets much credit for that.
If you don't like openSuse you have a choice.
Sorivenul said: FUD.
This is covered many times in many places around the forums. Despite the often excellent explanations and opinions on the matter, the original statements, "straight from the horse's mouth", offer a more orderly and informative approach. Examining the following will hopefully help clarify the Novell-Microsoft agreement for others: Novell and Microsoft - Working Together for Customers (From Novell) Open Letter to the Community (From Novell) Microsoft and Novell Collaborate (From Novell) Microsoft & Novell Interoperability Collaboration (From Microsoft) Microsoft and Novell Collaboration FAQ (From Microsoft) Novell and Microsoft - Interoperability (Joint Project)
...okay, I've read it... This means that Novell SLES(D) will be the only OS allowed to legally (based off EULA) virtualize any MS sku. MS hates the idea that no real enterprise is willing to run their server products on bare iron anymore, namely using *nix as host and running a couple of Win2k3 server vm(s) inside. (That's the part that kills them). These are not informative and I'm not trying to sound like the 'boycott Novell' website either. This explains nothing! I still haven't found any reason for Novell to sign a patent co-op, isn't an NDA good enough? When all is said and done, Mono will only be able to be run on SuSE... Read the open letter to the community again. This sounds like if you run anything other than Novell w/ MS in a heterogeneous environment you will be sued. The part that I didn't see was it is stipulated (I'll have to find it, it's great) that these patent and working together follies ONLY cover SLES(D), NOT openSuSE.... By the by, why wouldn't Novell issue a statement like that about 'we don't agree w/ MS on the patent issue'? They're customers would already be indemnified anyways...
openSUSE 11.1 doesn't support JFS. Deal-killer for me.
actually,YaST is one of the things that made me love opensuse,it makes u control the whole system,without having to edit text files,the package manager isn't that good,but it does the job :)
The agreement is available in the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission web site: http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/758004/000095013407012375/f26782exv10w35.htm
But you can just read the short version (http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/758004/000095013407012375/f26782e10vk.htm):
Under the Patent Cooperation Agreement, Microsoft agreed to covenant with our customers not to assert its patents against our customers for their use of our products and services for which we receive revenue directly or indirectly, with certain exceptions, while we agreed to covenant with Microsoft’s customers not to assert our patents against Microsoft’s customers for their use of Microsoft products and services for which Microsoft receives revenue directly or indirectly, with certain exceptions. In addition, we and Microsoft each irrevocably released the other party, and its customers, from any liability for patent infringement arising prior to November 2, 2006, with certain exceptions. Both we and Microsoft have payment obligations under the Patent Cooperation Agreement. Microsoft made an up-front net balancing payment to us of $108 million, and we will make ongoing payments to Microsoft
Plus the 3.4 part:
Nothing in this Agreement shall imply, or be construed as an admission or acknowledgement by a Party, that any Patents of the other Party are infringed, valid or enforceable.
Both Microsoft and Novell said "we will not sue your customers", that does NOT means that: a) I'm able to sue your customers b) I will not sue you
Even if the agreement meaned so... if Novell was acknowleding that Linux was violating Microsoft patents, then Microsoft was also acknowleding Windows was violating Novell patents... patents that probably are part of the Open Invention Network, so other members, like Red Hat, can use them.
But since the agreement doesn't protects Novell, only their customers, you can be sure that Novell will not try to use anything with a Microsoft patent.
So...
dca said: ...okay, I've read it... This means that Novell SLES(D) will be the only OS allowed to legally (based off EULA) virtualize any MS sku.
No. No idea from where you took that.
dca said: I still haven't found any reason for Novell to sign a patent co-op, isn't an NDA good enough?
A patent co-op has nothing to do with an NDA, what are you talking about???
dca said: When all is said and done, Mono will only be able to be run on SuSE...
Once again, false. If Novell infringes any Microsoft patent in Mono Microsoft can sue them (even if not the customers)... so Novell will not infringe any Microsoft patent in Mono.
dca said: By the by, why wouldn't Novell issue a statement like that about 'we don't agree w/ MS on the patent issue'?
Novell did just after Ballmer said that about Linux infringing 200+ Microsoft patents. I'm not going to search a link, point 3.4 of the agreement is already clear enough.
Why on the hell people talks so much about an agreement that just says "some people will be protected from a danger that doesn't exists" is something I will never understand.
openSUSE 11.1 doesn't support JFS. Deal-killer for me.
What the filesystem JFS. Yes it does I'm using it, I won't touch ext3 or Reiser because I hate them both.
RedDwarf said:
A patent co-op has nothing to do with an NDA, what are you talking about???
A Non Disclosure could've done the same thing... Instead of signing anything related to patents. "Before you look at how RPC works, sign this" kind of thing. No, it took the EU to get MS to commit to Samba signing NDAs. Everyone else sign a patent deal? I don't get it.
Yeah, I feel the same way, why wouldn't anyone want to look behind the curtain. I mean it's only companies that use Linux/FOSS that are getting duped into signing: Brother (Linux-friendly), LG (mobile division), Xandros (they have an Exchange-type service), et al.
Patent frenzy: http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2006/mar06/03-065000PatentPR.mspx
dca said: A Non Disclosure could've done the same thing... Instead of signing anything related to patents. "Before you look at how RPC works, sign this" kind of thing. No, it took the EU to get MS to commit to Samba signing NDAs. Everyone else sign a patent deal? I don't get it.
A Non-Disclosure Agreement is designed to protect information that has been shared in confidentiality. Confidentiality is only worthwhile if it were, well, confidential.
A patent, on the other hand, is in the realm of public records. It must be so that people know not to copy something you've patented. If you obscure a patent, then you cannot legally enforce your rights should somebody unknowingly copies it.
Anybody with the interest to view a patent may check with the Patents office/bureau/department in their country as well as those in other countries.
You can sign an NDA on patents but that would be pointless since anyone who cares to know can already find out. It would be like telling someone that the sky is blue and then making them sign an agreement not to tell anyone else this 'secret'.
I think it was kinda slow, and upgrading to KDE 4.2 sucked, there were a few errors and KDEmod's implementation of KDE was better(IMO). I wouldn't call it the Vista of distros, but it certainly could use some improvements. The studio thing they have planned seems nice though.
cardinals_fan said: openSUSE 11.1 doesn't support JFS. Deal-killer for me.
Novell SuSE Linux Enterprise Server does, I remember it being an option.
I'm not sure about OpenSuSE, but Novell SuSE Linux Enterprise Server was very good for me. I found it to be stable, reliable, fast and consistent. The KDE/Gnome GUI looked good on it. It is commercial, but I didn't pay for it, as I got it off a pirate site (Who would PAY for an OS?).
Now I use Debian instead for Linux.
I can't imagine that there is a big difference between OpenSuSE and SuSE Enterprise Server, since they are both SuSE distros... What are the differences between them?
Well Im writting this from Suse 11.1...At first it looked ok.For the first 15 minutes at least.The screen resolution is ill kinda weird to configure.I select 800x600 kai it blows up my screen by making it 1600x1200(which my monitor doesnt support)and then freezes.No multimedia out-of-th-box suport(I was kinda used to Sabayon)which again,i find ridicoulouw as its a DVD Dsitro.Couldnt they include 20MB worth of codedcs?Generally I find the selection of tools limited.Way too limited.Bad thing with Sabayon,is that I could make the key bindings to work,so if i wanted to cahnged languages,I hd to go with themouse to do it manually.Anyway...No Suse for me.Im still looking for something better.:popcorn: