Archived thread 1478826 from Maverick Meerkat Testing and Discussion (CLOSED). Markdown source: Maverick_Meerkat_Testing_and_Discussion_(CLOSED)/thread_1478826_UDS_discussions.md
The Ubuntu Developer Summit for Maverick has started, and it looks like it'll bring in a lot of goodies. News So far:
More info is available here.
This is shaping up to be one heck of a release, if they can pull all these off.
shafin said: The new Unity shell for UNE has been made available at ppa:canonical-dx-team/une.
I'll test it now. :D
Edit: Failed to fetch http://ppa.launchpad.net/canonical-dx-team/une/ubuntu/dists/maverick/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz
:( - you need to change the apt entry to say lucid instead of maverick.
shafin said: Mark wants Maverick to be launched on the 10th October, 2010.
That's two and a half weeks prior to the currently planned release date (according to the release schedule). 10.10.10 sounds nice but I doubt it's worth giving the devs a burnout or releasing a less ready Maverick.
i can't await the more refined application indicators, uniting applications which belong together.
and i'd like to see how the rework of global-menu, integrating the windowbuttons, will come out, though i don't really care for une, mainly because i haven't got a netbook. i just love to have as much space for content as possible and the quickest way of launching apps (i use do for that), so the global-menu-rework could really be a huge benefit for desktops as will.
also gnome3 is just great and every gnome-based distribution will benefit from that (i know it's obvious, but can hardly be mentioned too often ;) )
Does someone know what I want to listen to and keeps changing it?:P
There was supposed to be a discussion on the Me Menu, got changed to "Creation of a book to explain opportunistic development on Ubuntu", then just now there was supposed to be desktop UX talk, but that got outright removed
One of our admins is at UDS, he posted that he had lunch with Mark, and that Mark was already using the Unity desktop on his netbook, matthew said it looked quite impressive so far.
btw the post was in the staff sub-forum, so don't go looking for it. :)
Font beta? What's that?
Is there a meeting talking about the commercial aspects of the Ubuntu Software Center?
Starks said: Font beta? What's that?The new ubuntu font. Its ready for use.
We need a new cursor and hourglass.
starks said: we need a new cursor and hourglass.
+1
Atermoon said: +1
Yes.
Starks said: We need a new cursor and hourglass.
Really? For all the things that might need fixing up, something trivial as mouse icons pops in the mind...
What about mobile broadband connections that has gone haywire since jaunty...
Or graphics stack that causes regressions in older hardware.
or something else that effects vast amount of users. And not something user can change themselves.
Starks said: We need a new cursor and hourglass.
Why do we *need* a new cursor? I find the current cursor quite neutral and better looking than for example the windows cursor or all the glass themes. Anyways, I agree with taavikko, it can easily be changed. [Edit:] I'm much more looking forward to the new Unity!
taavikko said: Really?
For all the things that might need fixing up, something trivial as mouse icons pops in the mind...
What about mobile broadband connections that has gone haywire since jaunty...
Or graphics stack that causes regressions in older hardware.
or something else that effects vast amount of users. And not something user can change themselves.
People still have the notion that those that would supply artistic enhancements could supply technical ones??
Let's spell it out:
Whoever would work on the new cursors most likely wouldn't know about fixing a broadband connection or graphics stacks
Merk42 said: People still have the notion that those that would supply artistic enhancements could supply technical ones??
Let's spell it out:
Whoever would work on the new cursors most likely wouldn't know about fixing a broadband connection or graphics stacks
I was criticizing people who hopes/wishes merely artistic features/fixes, Instead something that would really make a difference.
Nothing to do with who develops what.
taavikko said: really make a difference
A Linux distribution without tons of cosmetic bugs WOULD make a difference... :KS
MacUntu said: A Linux distribution without tons of cosmetic bugs WOULD make a difference... :KS
I agree, but that requires a lot of love towards GTK ;) minor changes to gtkrc doesn't suffice. yet. :popcorn:
MacUntu said: A Linux distribution without tons of cosmetic bugs WOULD make a difference... :KS
Well... lets start with GTK+ 3.0...
taavikko said: I was criticizing people who hopes/wishes merely artistic features/fixes, Instead something that would really make a difference.
Nothing to do with who develops what.
I'm one of thoses "people who hopes/wishes merely artistic features/fixes", because like many others (i think) i haven't encountered technical problems since Hardy Heron : most people use common hardware which are well supported. Of course i'm not saying that it's useless to improve support of less common hardware, it's very important. But i think that improving artistic features would bring a lot of people who were repulsed by a poor UI, the amount of people talking about artistic features is a proof of that.
(sorry for my poor english)
Yeah put me in the list of people who have virtually no hardware problems (and I administer or run several dozen boxes). My only remaining hardware bug is on a computer that was purchased with an ubuntu oem install (fixed it with a quick hack to pm-suspend).
Well I don't much care about the looks crap as long as I have to put up with plymouth needing to be set slightly differently to just boot to installs that are on the same drive. Also having shut down times that range from .5 to 2.1 MINUTES on those same installs on the same drive.
What it looks like for several minutes after the drama and doubt period of booting is crap because of irritation. After a while I settle down and it looks alright again.
You could do a lot of changes to the looks of this OS in just the time wasted by this terrible boot sequence.
There really are things that matter more than looks. I do not care what it looks like, if this boot/plymouth/libplymouth2 stuff is not fixed, looks will not matter a bit. I will be using something that will boot without hacks and will shut down without hacks in less than 30 seconds let alone over 2 minutes.
There is your first impression. And last too.
Anyone else finding it impossible to listen on the icecast streams? It just keeps buffering but never playing
Why does it always have to end in the stupid discussion about what is more relevant and what's not... Why don't you all leave your egos aside for like two seconds and realize that everything makes a difference when you are working on software that you want to distribute to the masses? 3 years ago Ubuntu's interface looked pretty much like it was meant for a little kid to use... Now it looks fancy and attractive... even my younger brother asked me yesterday to install it on his laptop instead of Windows Vista...
I agree that solving bugs and stuff is really important but as someone else said here already, people working on looks probably won't have the skills to work on solving bugs so what's the problem on having people take care of that area while the rest focus on solving bugs!
Let's just work together for a better Ubuntu and not waste energy on arguing what is more important because it doesn't really matter... it can all be done at the same time. It should be done at the same time.
Grone1985 said: I agree that solving bugs and stuff is really important but as someone else said here already, people working on looks probably won't have the skills to work on solving bugs so what's the problem on having people take care of that area while the rest focus on solving bugs!
Let's just work together for a better Ubuntu and not waste energy on arguing what is more important because it doesn't really matter... it can all be done at the same time. It should be done at the same time.
+1 Why do people even need to explain this all over again?
I do not understand why folks can't understand that the graphic extras stand on the underlying structure.
It is that structure that has to be solid before there is a place to put the bright shiny stuff.
But we must keep in mind that understanding is as common as sense. If any of us had sense we would not be on this forum in the first place.
Let's have FUN.
Common sense tells me that I haven't had any major problems with the other four testing versions I've used, so this one should be good too. :)
In other news matthew reported he had a talk with the kernel development team, they are setting up a system to make it easier for us normal humans to be able to communicate with them. I know the one time I reported a bug concerning the kernel, I had an reply from a dev within a matter of hours, and the problem was resolved fairly quickly.
Do we know what kernel has been chosen yet?
Slug71 said: Do we know what kernel has been chosen yet?
Targeting 2.6.35 AFAIK
anyone knows why banshee didn't make it as default music player? i can't find notes for the reasons against it anywhere. i had lots of problems with 1.5.x but 1.6 is running like a breeze here.
Gourgi said: anyone knows why banshee didn't make it as default music player? i can't find notes for the reasons against it anywhere.
i had lots of problems with 1.5.x but 1.6 is running like a breeze here.
What? Ditched again?
Anyone know if delta-debs is confirmed for Maverick and if Packagekit will replace aptdaemon?
Slug71 said: What? Ditched again?
It's the default player in the Netbook edition. And it's going to become even better considering that it is the default player in Meego so expect some more full time developers there. Aaron Bockover from Novell is already hacking on it for the Meego platform.
Slug71 said: Anyone know if delta-debs is confirmed for Maverick and if Packagekit will replace aptdaemon?
IIRC blueprints are hashed out a week after UDS. There were some talks about apt-sync aka delta-debs but I didn't follow the session.
zekopeko said: It's the default player in the Netbook edition. And it's going to become even better considering that it is the default player in Meego so expect some more full time developers there. Aaron Bockover from Novell is already hacking on it for the Meego platform.
Sounds good. Might be worth the wait then.
zekopeko said: IIRC blueprints are hashed out a week after UDS. There were some talks about apt-sync aka delta-debs but I didn't follow the session.
Thanks, will check out the Blueprints in a week or so.
Slug71 said: What? Ditched again?
at least the last time they shafted true awesomeness, they left a laundry list.. this time we got nothing, so we don't even know what caused the proposal to fail.
gnomeuser said: at least the last time they shafted true awesomeness, they left a laundry list.. this time we got nothing, so we don't even know what caused the proposal to fail.
Probably because they still depend on HAL and the Ubuntu devs don't know if de-HALing is going to make it into 1.8.
You can read more here: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-desktop-application-selection
But that is all I found. I'm still puzzled with the choice of Shotwell. There was a list of where Shotwell falls short compared to F-spot or general usability but I can't find the document on gobby.ubuntu.com. Basically F-Spot doesn't have folder watching for new photos. And both have the "import before you look" model. So very confusing.
I've been using Shotwell since Jaunty, the one main advantage for me is that it doesn't create another directory full of pictures like F-Spot does. Not that I worry about hard drive space, but why have a duplicate photo directory.
F-Spot behaves unacceptable, eg. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/f-spot/+bug/69577 Desktop applications must not change user data unless told otherwise - EVER!
I hope Shotwell will fix this.
gnomeuser said: at least the last time they shafted true awesomeness, they left a laundry list.. this time we got nothing, so we don't even know what caused the proposal to fail.
Normally I make this list but Betrand Lorentz from Banshee was in Brussels involved in all the discussions (we had Jonathan Matthew from RB attend too) - so I'll have to get back to you or he'll likely blog.
Off the top of my head, libgpod support (I know someone is working on it), MPRIS and sound indicator integration (this is a new feature so RB and Banshee both need this work); this will allow us to drop the limited app indicator and use a proper kickass sound menu. We still need to figure out what's up with a11y (I think it's done but we don't turn it on or something like that).
More info to follow when I get home from UDS.
Here's the Sound Menu Link: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoundMenu/
so libgpod instead of podsleuth, sure that could be desireable but for the love of puppies rb doesn't even support proper device syncing or any type of media that isn't music or podcasts... it's a relic.
Also sad to see that F-spot was replaced the day before a new maintainer takes over, a new vastly improved release is put out and major changes are started in the development branch. Again a situation were not a whole lot has been communicated..
It's starting to feel a lot like UDS attendence is becoming mandatory if one wants any input or output on Ubuntu development.
gnomeuser said:
Also sad to see that F-spot was replaced the day before a new maintainer takes over, a new vastly improved release is put out and major changes are started in the development branch. Again a situation were not a whole lot has been communicated..
It's starting to feel a lot like UDS attendence is becoming mandatory if one wants any input or output on Ubuntu development.
That's largely true in terms of input/output regarding release goals, but remote participation works better than it did in the past.
And it seems Ruben Vermeersch was at UDS in person.